Apache OpenOffice (AOO) Bugzilla – Issue 7019
more pretty default colors
Last modified: 2013-02-24 21:20:02 UTC
if one doesn't have much time, one sticks with the standard color scheme, symbols and layout; I think however that these aren't very pretty; so therefore consider to "improve" these standard attributes of a newly created chart so that it looks better for presentation. [Improving standard "layout" is actually a general recommendation for all parts where such things are "preselected"]
Hi Falko, one for you.
Re-assigned to Matthias Müller-Prove for further evaluation.
to Bettina, our central dispatcher for RFEs
Reassigned to Björn.
->IHA: Sending you these issues so that all unconfirmed enhancements and features are at one place.
Its true that the default look of the chart needs to become more pretty and modern. But what should be done in detail has still to be defined. Any suggestions?
There are some issues related to this one: Issue 4291 is about having multiple color schemes Issue 12581 is about making the default settings customizable Issue 33793 is about offering templates for charts
added 'colors' to summary for better searching
Help of some color experts would be appreciated. There are 12 colors needed. They should be suiteable for thin lines as well as filled areas. They should be distinguishable on black and white printers as well.
Created attachment 41318 [details] beautiful color circle with 12 colors
The attachement shows a color circle consisting of 12 nice colors in the outside circle. At least for my own eyes, they are very nice colors for charts :-)
gleppert -> Nice colors :-) Are the "requirements" satisfied : - suiteable for thin lines as well as filled areas - distinguishable on black and white printers as well - Nice with 2D and 3D charts ? Could you attach a 2D and a 3D chart example with your colors ? Thanks.
Here is a second proposal, based on the tango palette and provided by Jakub Steiner.
Created attachment 41320 [details] the tango palette
For those wanting to try the result on OOo, here are two tips : - For adding colors to the palette that are not by default in OOo : Tools > Option... > OpenOffice.org > Colors - For changing default colors of a newly created chart : Tools > Option... > Chart > Default Colors
This are the files where the information is stored: OfficeInstallation/share/registry/schema/org/openoffice/Office/Chart.xcs or cvs: officecfg/registry/schema/org/openoffice/Office/Chart.xcs Look for this line: <value>0x9999ff 0x993366 0xffffcc 0xccffff 0x660066 0xff8080 0x0066cc 0xccccff 0x000080 0xff00ff 0x00ffff 0xffff00</value> It contains 12 RGB default colors for the chart.
Please note: the colors should be easily distinguishable!!
Created attachment 41328 [details] Chart default palette from the early chart2-days. Just copy as "user-dir"/user/registry/data/org/openoffice/Office/Chart.xcu
Created attachment 41329 [details] Another chart palette
Created attachment 41330 [details] And a third one with nice colors :-)
Created attachment 41349 [details] Tango colors (http://tango-project.org)
Created attachment 41354 [details] Color circle Ilten
Created attachment 41355 [details] Sample charts for Color circle Ilten
Created attachment 41357 [details] Sample charts for Color circle 2
Created attachment 41358 [details] Sample charts for Color circle 3
Created attachment 41381 [details] Sample charts for Color circle Tango
Of course the OO.o default palette would not matter so much if it was able to take advantage of the palettes that already ship with major FLOSS drawing apps (Issue 67648) I see the Tango palette being proposed there for example - why should it be recoded in yet another proprietary format when a reference file already exists for the Gimp or Inkscape (don't remember which, they share their palettes on my system)
Another interresting comment from obi : http://un.regne.net/dotclear/index.php/2006/12/13/79-choosing-a-default-color-palette-for-ooo-charts Choosing a color palette for OOo is quite a tough challenge, 12 shades of gray is a lot, 7/8 is the limit of what you can distinguish "easily". So I tried a pragmatic approach, with shades of gray from 25% to 90%, a first row of 6 colors sticking to 10 multiples, and a second one with multiples of 5. Then setting saturation to 100% (assuming vibrant colors are the best to draw charts), there's only the hue left to play with. So aesthetically speaking, it's, hum, perfectible. Slight gradient to darker colors somehow improve the results. Anyway, IMO, the best way to make colors stand-out on any background are outlines (I like thick rounded outlines, but it gives a cartoonesque look which might be inappropriate). Inverse video is also very efficient, but not always nice to the eyes. Yet another solution is to associate two colors, one for the fill and another one for the outline so your chances of confusion are lowered (2 hints instead of 1). Or to associate motifs to colors (stripes, bubbles, stars), but this does not work for lines. Anyway, here's a first try
Created attachment 41407 [details] Some tries about colors, by obi
Added bm to CC
Created attachment 41455 [details] 6 color default palette from Apple iWork suite
I think the Tango -project's set of color represent the most cross-platform feel to the colors. I am currently most familiar with Mac OS X, but have also used Windows and Linux. As previous comments have stated 12 well-combining colors is quite much, although probably not impossible. Apple's iWork suite uses only 6 default colors (7th uses the 1st color etc), see attachment above. I would vote for using the Tango palette directly and then refining the 2D and 3D views of the charts to make those colors look good. Especially the 3D -view seems to need overall increase in luminance. This is more or less what Apple has done (see the difference in colors between 2D and 3D chart, in the attachment above).
From a post on the KDE-Usability lists, I've got an answer from Daniel J. Wilson pointing to an interresting link: <quote> I'm also working on chart design and have found Maureen C. Stone's writing on color useful: http://www.stonesc.com/pubs/Expert%20Color%20Choices.pdf </quote>
From a post on the KDE-Usability lists, I've got an answer from Daniel J. Wilson pointing to an interresting link: quote: I'm also working on chart design and have found Maureen C. Stone's writing on color useful: http://www.stonesc.com/pubs/Expert%20Color%20Choices.pdf
From a post on the KDE-Usability lists, I've got an answer from Daniel J. Wilson pointing to an interresting link. quote: """ I'm also working on chart design and have found Maureen C. Stone's writing on color useful: http://www.stonesc.com/pubs/Expert%20Color%20Choices.pdf """
test
Created attachment 41732 [details] Maureen C. Stone's writing on color use
Sorry for posting multiple times, there was a problem with issue tracker... Can the duplicate comments be removed ?
Just for info, there is a palette for the new OOo Icons (Galaxy theme). This may be useful. Here is the link: http://ui.openoffice.org/VisualDesign/OOo_galaxy.html#colors BTW, there was an issue closed about a new color palette for draw where palettes are attached: Issue 52162
Bjoern and I just had a conversation about this. Having a more compelling color set for (new) charts would be good. However, there is one constraint: we must not decrease the current level of MS Office interoperability, i.e. after alering the default set, the colors of any given Excel (Version 2000-2007) chart loaded in Calc have to be as similar to the original as they are today. This may imply, that our new default colors for chart need to match (at least to some extent) with the old Excel chart palette... A few more things to keep in mind: The new chart colors need to be available in the default office color palette, too, so they can also be used for other charting / drawing elements. Looking at the current office palette, it seems likely that we need to enhance it, in order to have a well working subset for charts. Enhancing the office palette by more than (I believe) 12 colors, leads to usability problems in the color drop downs in Writer and Calc. And last but not least: For "old" documents containing charts, users need to have an option to switch between the new and the old chart color palette, in order to add charts that look consistently to the existing ones.
->lho: I talked to the filter developer dr and he told me that there is no hurdle with excel import or export. He knows all the colors he needs to know, completely independent from the choice for the 12 default colors. So that is not a problem.
chart module: Vote for the new default colors Do you want to see the default chart colors changed? So, please, just go to that page and vote: http://ui.openoffice.org/VisualDesign/OOoChart_colors_drafts.html
Created attachment 43281 [details] Comparison of same colors in different charts (black and white)
*CHART2: Default Colours* "Color used well can enhance and clarify a presentation. Color used poorly will obscure, muddle and confuse.* -- Maureen Stone Unfortunately, people have difficulty learning this simple fact. I just voted for the new default pallet to be used in Chart2, yet I was NOT very impressed by the various pallets. The last colour scheme (number 12, blue - yellow) is probably the better one, but even this one lacks professionalism. *What is the problem*? As the first quote from Maureen Stone says, *too many colors* will obscure and confuse. Therefore I will try to expand this concept further and add some real-life examples from professional presentations. A few remarks are needed before expanding this issue: 1.) EXAMPLES ============ I will add some examples as jpg-images to better show the reasoning for the colours. I attach some professional charts taken from the WHO 2005 and 2006 reports. The full reports (some 5 - 7 MB) can be downloaded from http://www.who.int/entity/whr/2005/whr2005_en.pdf and http://www.who.int/whr/2006/whr06_en.pdf (while for older reports see http://www.who.int/whr/previous/en/index.html). Please take a look at these charts, they look really good. 2.) BLACK-WHITE =============== Sometimes, charts get printed on black-white printers, or colour presentations are copied on a black-white photocopying machine (quite often). Many colour-schemes fail poorly in this instance due to poor contrast/luminosity difference between 2 neighboring fields. 3.) PREVIOUSLY e-MAILED ======================= 2.) I e-mailed a similar post to the chart mailing list. However, presumably because I appended some jpg-images, the post never showed up. 2'.) I sent a similar e-mail (with jpg-attachements) directly to people working for Sun (e.g. to Ingrid Halama), but got NO response either, so it was presumably deleted as well. 2''.) this is my third attempt and I will post it as a comment to issue 7019 (http://www.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=7019). I will attach the beforementioned jpg-images to that issue, too. This is a greatly expanded review. 3.) TOC ======= This document will be organised as follows: a. INTRODUCTION b. BAR CHARTS b'. 2-3 Colours b''. MONOCHROME MODEL c. PIE CHARTS and other Chart Types d. DEFAULT EXAMPLES a. INTRODUCTION =============== Colours used in a chart should clarify the chart and NOT confuse the viewer. Unfortunately, this is difficult when choosing many colours as they 1.) tend to distract the viewer from the relevant information and 2.) obscure some of the colours used. This is the reason why professional presentations never use more than 5 different colour groups (hue-groups). Actually, IF more groups seem to be needed, there are 2 ways to resolve this issue: - either the user does NOT recognise the essentials in the chart (to *highlight only the essential information*), or - (IF – rarely – the previous statement does NOT apply) use basically a *single hue-group* This will be further expanded for BAR-Charts and separately for the OTHER-Chart types. b. BAR CHARTS ============= Bar charts are likely to contain many groups of data. A common mistake is to draw every BAR a different colour. This is both unnecessary and obstructs the meaning of the bar chart. A good colour-scheme will have to distinguish between: B1. are there only 2 groups of data: then use of 2 oppsoing colours (significantly different hues) is OK. Also, make the luminosity different, so that black-white printing looks good, too. B2. are there 3-5 groups of data: selecting 3 to 5 different colours is feasible, BUT alternatives using only 1-2 colours are equally effective. B3. more than 5 bars: NEVER use more than 5 colour-groups!!! To quote Maureen Stone again: "In most design situations, the best results are achieved by limiting hue to a palette of two or three colors, and using hue and chroma variations within these hues to create distinguishably different colors. Such a palette is both aesthetically pleasing and functional. It minimizes an over-dependence on hue variation (which can cause visual clutter), and replaces it with careful control of value and chroma. Figure 8 shows several such palettes, and their location on the hue wheel." -- Maureen Stone There are some solutions to this problem: i.) do we need to highlight *SOMETHING*? NO => just use the same colour for every bar (*MONOCHROME*) ii.) IF we need to highlight 1 or 2 groups of data, apply a different colour only to those 1-2 groups (maximum colours used = 3). IF you need to highlight more than 3 groups, you are doing something wrong. [in the rare situation, where a bar graph is drawn for a group of 4 or more items repeated several times, use either monochrome, or see later for pie-charts, BUT strong consideration should be given NOT to compare 2 or more groups of MORE THAN 4 items each] C. PIE CHARTS (& other chart types) ============= A similar reasoning applies to pie charts as for bar charts: NEVER use more than 5 colour-groups. However, pie charts often have more data groups, therefore sometimes a different solution is needed: C1. 2 data groups => NEVER draw a pie chart with ONLY 2 segments (as the second segment will always be (1 - first segment)) C2. 3-4(-5) data groups: use of 3-(5) different colour groups is possible (though alternatives are equally effective) C3. more than 5 data groups: this is tricky; obviously we can NOT use a monochrome drawing. HOWEVER, more than 5 different colour groups is a strong NO. Instead, use only one colour group (rarely 2), with: - slight hue-variations (NOTE: the next version is better) - *contrast/luminosity* changes: 2 adjacent colours should have very different luminosities, so that black-white printing looks OK and also viewing in colour highlights the difference. IF there are more than 8-10 groups of data, the user makes something wrong!!! Some of the groups should be contracted into a single group. Also, with more than 5 colours, some of the colours are chosen as *shades of gray* (+ sometimes the colour black). This fits in the concept of only luminosity changes (with sometimes colour saturation changes). An example will be presented from the WHO report. Other charts (like line and dot charts) bear similarity to the pie charts. D. DEFAULT EXAMPLES =================== I have looked to the various chart styles on the voting page. Some look interesting, though NONE looks really professionally. If I was to choose from the available, I'll probably prefer the last one (number 12, blue - yellow - for which I actually voted). This is the only one to have a professional look. All multi-colour styles just don't seem right. Please NOTE that even this one fails for the bar chart: there are simply to many colours. Instead use either a single colour or only 2 colours (whith the second one to highlight only important parts of the bar chart). Various other professional examples from WHO reports will be presented in a second writer document attached to the previous issue. CONCLUSIONS =========== a.) *multi-coloured charts* actually never look professional IF the chart contains many groups of data, instead of using dozens of colours, consider: i.) a *single colour* (see attached Chart_Bars_Styles_Blue.jpg) ii.) a limited number of similar colours + shades of gray (see examples Chart_Bars_Styles_Orange.jpg, and most other examples) In this latter case, consider using the highest contrast colour-pair to highlight only the important aspects of the chart. Therefore, it is really NOT important to have dozens of colours, BUT rather a limited number of them and use them appropriately. b.) there is a huge difference if somebody draws a chart only with 2 groups of data (high contrast might be OK in this case), 3-5 groups (medium contrast and optimal colour spread) or > 5 groups (various shades/hues of same colour interspersed with gray tones). Having more than 5 completely different (widely differing) colours looks awfully. c.) As a last note: I would prefer more than one colour scheme. As pointed previously, different schemes for the BAR and PIE charts, as well as the 2 groups case, 3-5 and >5 groups case is also warranted. Cheers, Leonard Mada
Created attachment 43519 [details] EXAMPLES of Colour Schemes
Taking over. Checked in the new default palette that was voted for. See http://ui.openoffice.org/VisualDesign/OOoChart_colors_results.html for the voting results.
Fixed in CWS chart2mst3. Changed files: * officecfg/registry/schema/org/openoffice/Office/Chart.xcs * svx/source/dialog/Attic/cfgchart.cxx Note, that the new colors are not yet in the color palette (standard.soc).
changed target and flags
Please verify in CWS chart2mst3.
Now we have 12 nice new colors, but they are not yet in the standard color palette of OOo, so you cannot use them to set the color of objects to one of them yet. This is addressed in Issue 75202.
verified follow up issue is i75397
This one is fixed. Chart now has new default colors that were voted on. Seen good in m215 → closing.